Part 1
As the novel comes to a close, we find the suitors being lead by Hermes, passed the gates of Hades where they are greeted by the ghosts of Argememnon and Achilles. They all explain how they have met their untimely deaths. Both Argememnon and Achilles explain that they were killed on Trojan soil during the war. The suitors explain they were killed by Odysseus, but they blame Penelope for their deaths because of her inability to choose a new husband. While they continue to put the blame on her, Argememnon explains to them that she is not as bad compared to his wife, Clytemnestra. " ...what outrage she committed. killing the man she married once!-- yes, and the song men sing of her will ring with loathing" (24.220-221). I think this comparison is made because although the suitors claim it is because of her that caused their deaths, she had this difficulty because she had found the love of her life in Odysseus and she could not let that go. " ...what a fine, faithful wife you won! What good sense resided in your Penelope-- how well Icarius' daughter remembered you, Odysseus, the man she married once!" (24.212-215). Penelope is considered a faithful wife because although it seemed as if Odysseus was never going to return, she is hesitant about choosing a new husband, while Clytemnestra went against the values the typical wife contained.
GQ #1: Under what conditions would you consider revenge as acceptable?
Part 2
Simile: "...and the ghosts trailed after with high thin cries as bats cry in the depths of a dark haunted cavern..." (24.6-7). As the suitors were entering the gates of Hades, they were screaming as loud as bats, indicating their fears when they are introduced to the underworld.
Journey to the Underworld: As the suitors are killed off, they are all sent into the underworld because of their wicked behavior, "..where the dead, the burnt-out wraiths of mortals, make their home" (24.14). Because of this, they are forever living in pain and suffering in "..the dank moldering paths.." (24.11).
Introduction: The main theme in the intro tends to be Hades and how it affects the people who enter for the first time. When the suitors enter, they are screaming as loud as bats in a dark cave, and war heroes like Argememnon and Achilles appear before them. Homer describes Hades as dark and dank, "passed the White Rock and the Sun's Western Gates and past the Land of Dreams.." (24.13-14). This makes me believe that it is reason to believe to abandon all hope when one enters the gates of Hades.
Translator's Notes: "To urge Odysseus to sail" (24.126)- Odysseus is unwilling to leave his wife and son in order to fight the Torjans. He summoned a plow, harnessed with an ox, and drove it, sowing salt in the furrows, in protest of going to Troy. Palamedes put Odysseus' son in the path of the plow, causing him to stop. When I first read the line in the chapter, I did not think Odysseus, at first, tried to escape going to war against the Trojans, but after reading the translations, it caused me to question his bravery before he became a war hero.
GQ #2: If you were being sent off to a distant land to fight a war, how would you react?
Part 3
One of the major themes that continues to play a role in the story is the role of gods/goddesses. While Odysseus is at Laertes' house, the families of the fallen suitors decide to avenge their deaths by trying to attack Odysseus. In order to avoid more bloodshed, Athena intervenes, disguised as Mentor, killing Eupithes, the father of Antinous. She then makes the Ithacans forget about the murders of their sons, and have them recognize Odysseus as King of Ithaca.
While reading this, it reminded me of a scene in the movie, Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. In the scene, Hermione is beginning to go on the mission to destroy the horcroxes in order to kill Voldemort. Before she leaves her home for good, she casts a spell on her parents in order for them to forget about her completely, so that they will not be saddened if she ends up getting killed.
GQ #3: Do you think that the days of Odysseus as a hero are over or will they continue on in Ithaca?
Revenge is acceptable when a person has been pushed to a certain degree. Everyone has a different amount of tolerance and taking revenge really depends on what pushes your buttons. Acceptable is a tough word in this case because a lot of times revenge is not considered acceptable. Revenge happens when people have simply had enough. So the conditions are different for everyone.
ReplyDeleteIt depends on the war. If it was a cause that I believed in then I would have pride in being sent off. On the other hand if I thought the war was for an unjust reason then I would be unsure and hesitant to leave. Either way it would be difficult to leave my family and friends.
Odysseus will always be a hero in Ithaca. His legacy will continue to live. Once Odysseus is gone, his honor and legacy will live through Telemachus. Odysseus is a war hero and accomplished some amazing feats and for this he will always be remembered in Ithaca most likely as a hero.
#1 When someone crosses a line and goes to extremes they need to be put in place. That is when I think revenge is necessary. Getting revenge on a joke is a different story, but when it comes to hurting someone that hurt you either physically or mentally there are extremes. If someone messed with my family or close friends I would want to set things straight and get even.
ReplyDelete#2 I would refuse to go to war if I were asked to. I have no reason to fight someone I don't even know. I would not me much support or help for our side because I would not want to kill anyone that didn't deserve it. War is not my scene and I do not have enough passion to fight in a war.
#3 I don't think the days of Odysseus being a hero are even close to being over. He is this big, macho man that people look up to. I think he will continue to be a heroic figure for those of his homeland.
1. Even though I try to avoid revenge at all costs, sometimes it just happens as a result of human nature. But to me, I don’t think it is ever acceptable to take revenge on anyone no matter what trials have been put on you; it’s always best to turn the other cheek when you are faced with something that upsets you.
ReplyDelete2. If I were being sent off to a distant land to fight a war, that would be insane! I think I would be dumbfounded since going to war has rarely crossed my mind. After coming to reality, I would feel remorse having to leave my family and home. For me, I truly dislike the concept of war so I probably would not be of any help during the fighting.
3. Being a hopeful person, I don’t think Odysseus’s days in Ithaca are over. And even if he passes away in the near future, his legacy as a hero will be in Ithaca forever.
I think that revenge is rarely acceptable in today’s society because we are taught to understand things like forgiveness and justice. Quotes include: “An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind”, “Two wrongs don’t make a right”, etc. In the novel, killing people is totally normal so killing a person out of revenge would seem acceptable. Nowadays, we have much more difficulty in determining whether it is alright or not and get into all sorts of arguments over things like the death penalty. Revenge can only be seen as acceptable if a person has been pushed to farthest limit.
ReplyDeleteIf I was being sent off somewhere to fight a war for a something I believed in it would be alright with me, but if I was being forced against my will I’d be pissed.
Odysseus will always be remembered as a great hero until his death and I believe his legacy will continue to live on through Telemachus. To me it doesn’t matter if he continues doing such heroic things because he has already been through so much and deserves a peaceful retirement.
I think there are situations where revenge is acceptable. Some people are just pushed too far over the edge and not reacting can be really difficult. If someone has gone to such extremes to give another feelings of wanting to evoke the same pain onto them, than that something must have been horrible and it’s natural for people to feel aggression and frustration.
ReplyDeleteI guess I can’t know how I feel until I’m placed in the situation, but if I had to be sent off to war, I definitely agree with Trent. If it’s a cause that I believe in and it’s defending principles, rights, freedom, or my nation then that’s my duty. I know I would be scared all the time and feel like I wouldn’t be up to the task, but it’s belief and my country so fear has to somehow go on the backburner.
I feel that Odysseus will never be forgotten and forever remain a hero in Ithaca. He’s a soldier, a king, and a neighbor to his people. He will always be respected and revered for his sacrifices and strength.